What's everyone's prefered Clowes?

[jporcellino]

To me, Ice Haven (the Eightball #22 version) is still the best comic I've ever read. I remember when the 90s Eightball was coming out, with the short stories, stuff like "Like a Weed Joe," etc and you'd think "he can never top this!" and then with the next issue he would. You could feel the firmament of comics shifting underfoot with each new issue.

[cameronarthur]

David Boring, Ghost World and Caricature are my favorites of his

[cartoonysam]

Eightball Clowes is my favorite for his more satirical comics such as Pussey, Art School Confidential, and Hippypants and Peace Bear. Post-Eightball Clowes contains some of his best character-driven narratives such as Patience, Wilson, and Mr. Wonderful which feel more reflective. I think Ghost World bridged the gap between those two eras in the best way possible.

[BubblesZine]

Bump

New Clowes in October, "Monica"

Looks awesome

[cartoonysam]

Mar 9, 2023 20:08:51 GMT BubblesZine said:

Bump

New Clowes in October, "Monica"

Looks awesome

This is probably is the best comics release news I've heard this year!

[junkflower]

Here's a silly one for fun... is Clowes the GOAT?

I realize on the face of it nobody will wanna say yes, but I just feel like...

- Everyone reads Clowes. Everyone has some take on pretty much everything he puts out, and this isn't controversial. Even when someone criticizes Clowes I feel like there's always an implied reverential side to it
- He is innovative, but... cleanly. When he pushes forward it pretty much always has worked
- Nobody really thinks he's getting worse. Los Bros are maybe the closest to Clowes in terms of unimpeachable status, but there's always a kind of "are they falling off?" side to discussions about their current work

I don't know. I could go on. I don't even consider myself a Clowes superfan or anything, but I don't think it'd be controversial to be like "he's pretty much the best," yknow?

[BubblesZine]

I mean, by those measurements I'd agree. I'm laughing about how dead on you are about how I sound when I do critique Clowes, definitely with reverence. I always thought he was one of the kings of lettering without a doubt.

[manoopuesta]

I'm not a fan of picking anybody specific as the GOAT since there are so many aspects to comics... but if I had to choose, I would say that would be Jaime Hernández.

While Clowes is not getting worse, in my opinion his peak was when he was serializing Ghost World and David Boring in Eightball. Jaime on the other hand has been improving his storytelling chops in a remarkable way, I think. But mainly, someone that can pull off something like The Love Bunglers, is in my opinion definitely the GOAT.

Edit: of course, I disregarded most of your points. I write in an emotional way more than anything, sorry, hahah

[eheitner]

Jun 8, 2023 22:49:24 GMT manoopuesta said:

I'm not a fan of picking anybody specific as the GOAT since there are so many aspects to comics... but if I had to choose, I would say that would be Jaime Hernández.

While Clowes is not getting worse, in my opinion his peak was when he was serializing Ghost World and David Boring in Eightball. Jaime on the other hand has been improving his storytelling chops in a remarkable way, I think. But mainly, someone that can pull off something like The Love Bunglers, is in my opinion definitely the GOAT.

Edit: of course, I disregarded most of your points. I write in an emotional way more than anything, sorry, hahah

Hey not to nitpick but looks like you misspelled Gilbert. Sentence should read "Gilbert Hernandez is the GOAT."

Tbh Clowes has never really hit for me.

[manoopuesta]

Jun 9, 2023 10:51:08 GMT eheitner said:

Hey not to nitpick but looks like you misspelled Gilbert. Sentence should read "Gilbert Hernandez is the GOAT."

hahaha.

I think at this point there is clear, differentiated Gilbert and Jaime teams. Not that there's anything wrong with what Gilbert does now, but I used to like more Gilbert's work in his Palomar era.

And back to Clowes: one of the things that makes me not pick him as the GOAT is that some of his stories (mainly the Eightball short stories) read very white male oriented. That's totally fair, they come from his own experience and he decides to source from that. But as a woman they make me feel a bit alienated at times. In contrast, I never get that same vibe with the Hernandez brothers, specially Jaime.

[bayls171]

I think it’s interesting you disregard Gilbert & Jaime due to discussion about whether they have fallen off.. but post-Patience, Wilson, and Mister Wonderful i don’t think there even is a debate anymore about whether Clowes has fallen off.. I’m hopeful for Monica tho

Snarkiness aside, I do think you have a point regarding the way people talk about Clowes with a fair deal of reverence. But IMO that crown would go to Beto, although Jaime would be #2 and a slightly less controversial pick just due to how weird Gilbert’s work has been for so long

Disclaimer: I am a los bros simp

[junkflower]

I'm actually sort of surprised (but not really)- I figured the Clowes/GOAT thing would be a casual dunk. Either way, it's whatever, it's just for fun and the sake of discussion.

Can def see the points about being alienated by the white/maleness. Could also agree that Wilson (underrated IMO) and Mister Wonderful are kind of a falloff, but IMO he got back up there with Patience.

By volume I'd still probably argue against the Los Bros. Clowes only has like 100 or so pages of stuff I think is just OK or not good. Conversely, both Jaime and Beto have done a lot of work I basically just have no interest in (all of Jaime's non-Locas stuff honestly- can't get into it; Beto has a few weak ones but tbh I am a recent convert to his latter stuff and absolutely love it)

[chocolatemoloko]

I think the Death Ray is my favourite, but Ice Haven is really close. In general I like Clowes post Eightball #19 then his earlier stuff.

[cartoonysam]

Jun 9, 2023 17:10:57 GMT junkflower said:

I'm actually sort of surprised (but not really)- I figured the Clowes/GOAT thing would be a casual dunk. Either way, it's whatever, it's just for fun and the sake of discussion.

Can def see the points about being alienated by the white/maleness. Could also agree that Wilson (underrated IMO) and Mister Wonderful are kind of a falloff, but IMO he got back up there with Patience.

By volume I'd still probably argue against the Los Bros. Clowes only has like 100 or so pages of stuff I think is just OK or not good. Conversely, both Jaime and Beto have done a lot of work I basically just have no interest in (all of Jaime's non-Locas stuff honestly- can't get into it; Beto has a few weak ones but tbh I am a recent convert to his latter stuff and absolutely love it)

Clowes later graphic novels are some of my favorite works of his because of how increasingly emotionally honest they are. But I think the Eightball days were when he was at his comedic peak.